Welcome to the website for the TiddlyWiki European Meetup 2016.

Think local, act global!

Discussion • Location • Agenda • SiteMap • LiveStream

Compare the static HTML and interactive renderings of this site

Topics

• Formalising project roles
• Future of TiddlySpace
• Cleaning up open PRs and issues
• How to make the greatest positive impact on the project?
• How to use this meetup as a promotional tool for the next one?

Activities

We planned to work together to add server-side twederation to the meetup website, and use the emerging threaded discussion to document our activities:

http://tiddlywiki.com/tiddlywiki-eu-meetup-2016/

Steps:

1. Add Travis-based continuous integration to https://github.com/Jermolene/tiddlywiki-eu-meetup-2016/
2. Add client-side Twederation plugins and explore at https://github.com/Jermolene/tiddlywiki-eu-meetup-2016/wiki.html
3. Implement necessary server-side Twederation components

Trello

We discussed potential agenda items on a public Trello board.

This is the federated discussion from the time of the meetup.

• Over night some things broke - The TWederation (2016072509h5608)
  

  I am trying to make it so when you request a bundle you only get new things. This is turning out to be a bigger problem than I expected due to browser caching interfering with getting an accurate estimate of the previous time there was nothing new on a wiki. I have implemented some more changes that may work now even with that. Unfortunately you may have to delete some system tiddlers. Delete the tiddlers that start with $:/FetchHistory/. This code will make a button that will remove them.

  When things work correctly than you should only receive bundles when there is new content. Unfortunately for testing this is identical behaviour to something being broken. This is code for a button that will reset record of previous times in case you can't fetch new content. So click the button and try again! But hopefully the newest plugin version should fix the problem. That is twederation-core version 0.0.49 and twederation-edition version 0.0.55. Here is the code

  <$button>Clear Fetch Record<$list filter='[prefix[$:/FetchHistory/]]'><$action-deletetiddler tiddler=<<currentTiddler>>/></$list></$button>

  Lets see what new thing broke!!

• Well that didn't last long - inmysocks (2016072509h2503)
  

  Birthe went and figured out how to make herself an avatar. So I got to be the only one with an avatar for a few hours. :D Now we will have to make something to package the avatars with the twCards and I need to add a way for people to get updated twCards, since I had to manually import Birthe's new card and her avatar image.

  Also I apparently broke things last night, but they should be working again now. So make sure you update both the core and edition plugins!

• And now I am not certain that I didn't break anything - inmysocks (2016072508h5412)
  

  If things work the way they should than you should only get new things when fetching bundles, but I may have broken something so you don't ever get anything when fetching bundles. We shall see...

• Can I write a post? - Birthe (2016072506h0504)
  

  If not I do not need an avatar.

• Comment - Can I write a post? - Birthe (2016072506h0504)The TWederation - There are some problems with the inputs
  

  I haven't tracked them down yet though. For me it keeps losing focus and when I press backspace the browser interprets that as clicking the back button. This is a very annoying problem and I don't have any explanation yet.

• Comment - Can I write a post? - Birthe (2016072506h0504)Birthe - I realise that was a strange post
  

  But trying to write a post my wiki refreshes or take focus all sorts of places. I have never visited tiddlyspot/backup as often as now. This is also the explanation if something seems odd or missing. One moment it is here, the other.....noone knows.

• I feel like just inmysocks is a step down from speaking as The TWederation - inmysocks (2016072500h2537)
  

  But here I am, where I can be weird in a typical fashion, just like everyone else. Also I have an avatar and you don't. The TWederation should also have an avatar, and soon Mat should have one. We need to figure out how to make it work correctly for everyone.

• Comment - I feel like just inmysocks is a step down from speaking as The TWederation - inmysocks (2016072500h2537)The TWederation - Nothing is automated yet
  

  The conversation in the comments of this post makes me very happy. Both because it shows that you can have a conversation using twederation but also because people have figured out how to make and add their own avatars without me saying anything. This made my day :D. I will find some way to automate the exchange of avatars and other icons sometime soon.

• Comment - I feel like just inmysocks is a step down from speaking as The TWederation - inmysocks (2016072500h2537)Birthe - Invisible avatar, that is weird
  

  Fetching you post I don't see anything

• Comment - Comment - I feel like just inmysocks is a step down from speaking as The TWederation - inmysocks (2016072500h2537)Birthe - Invisible avatar, that is weird - MAS -
  

  My consultant tells me that you need to drag over the image (Avatar Icon - inmysocks.svg) from twederation. Then drag over Jed's new card ( $:/twCard/Typically Weird - http://ooktech.com/jed/TypicallyWeird/) and/or refresh the cards.

• Comment - Comment - Comment - I feel like just inmysocks is a step down from speaking as The TWederation - inmysocks (2016072500h2537)Birthe - Invisible avatar, that is weird - MAS - - Birthe -
  

  Thank you. I kind of figured that out but thought it was kind of cheating. Well, cheating it is then! I could just as well cheat myself to an avatar also and edit my twCard,

• Comment - Comment - I feel like just inmysocks is a step down from speaking as The TWederation - inmysocks (2016072500h2537)Birthe - Invisible avatar, that is weird - MAS - Just loaded the latest (?) plugins. Like Birthe, I don't see an avatar. Are there supporting plugins required?
  

• Comment - Comment - Comment - I feel like just inmysocks is a step down from speaking as The TWederation - inmysocks (2016072500h2537)Birthe - Invisible avatar, that is weird - MAS - Just loaded the latest (?) plugins. Like Birthe, I don't see an avatar. Are there supporting plugins required? - Birthe -
  

  The twCards are updated to show the avatars. After updating you will see empty placeholders for images we do not get.

• The TWederation has spoken - The TWederation (2016072422h5231)
  

  Or I just like pretentious names and want to distinguish between my personal stuff and news about twederation. So I have my own site now over here, you can get the card for it by fetching the cards from twederation.tiddlyspot.com under the Fetch Communication tab. So now things posted as twederation new should be by The TWderation and things that are from me are just inmysocks.

  And this way I can speak as The TWederation, which amuses me.

• Comment - The TWederation has spoken - The TWederation (2016072422h5231)MAS -
  

  Wait, the official voice of the Twederation is from "TypicallyWeird" ?

• Comment - Comment - The TWederation has spoken - The TWederation (2016072422h5231)MAS - - The TWederation - I suppose that may be open to some interpretation...
  

  But my personal site is Typically Weird, the official twederation site is twederation.tiddlyspot.com and speaks as The TWederation. If this bothers you than you may not want to work with me very much.

  The reason for the distinction is that at some point in the future it is possible someone else may take over twederation development (there are no plans for this, but I like to make things run smoothly) and then they would take over the twederation.tiddlyspot.com site. So I am not going to put any of my personal things on that site.

• Comment - Comment - Comment - The TWederation has spoken - The TWederation (2016072422h5231)MAS - - The TWederation - I suppose that may be open to some interpretation... - MAS -
  

  Sorry, got it backwards.

• I have a limited attention span - inmysocks (2016072421h2330)
  

  So instead of making more for twederation I have spent the past few hours playing on the internet and making new svg icons. This made me want to add avatar images to the discussions here so I made myself one and one for Mat. I should make a twederated wiki for myself that isn't the main wiki here for personal stuff. Anyway, if you want to see what I have been spending my time on instead of improving twederation the icons are here. You will have to go to the twederation.tiddlyspot.com wiki instead of seeing them in this post because I don't have any way to add attachments to posts. That may come in the future, but for now we will just have to visit another wiki instead of importing something.

• Comment - I have a limited attention span - inmysocks (2016072421h2330)Birthe - Nice avatars and icons
  

  Please, if you want to create more, I would very much like an avatar. I have tried several times, but have had to realise that this it nor for me. (There is a reason I am reusing the basic drawings created years ago for all my knitting patterns.)

• Need a way to mark incoming posts/comments as "read" - MAS (2016072411h5025)
  

  To save space, I deleted the group photo (sorry guys – I have to connect via FTP). But then the photo keeps wanting to come back as "new". We need a way to mark incoming items as "read" (maybe using a dictionary datatype tiddler?).

• Comment - Need a way to mark incoming posts/comments as "read" - MAS (2016072411h5025)The TWederation - There is supposed to be something doing that
  

  But it obviously doesn't work. I will try to fix that now because it is causing other problems as well.

• Comment - Need a way to mark incoming posts/comments as "read" - MAS (2016072411h5025)inmysocks - There is supposed to be a setting
  

  That doesn't work yet. You will be able to get only posts that are newer than the last time you got new posts. I guess I will work on that now instead of playing with making new icons.

• favicon - set type to be image.png - Mat von TWaddle (2016072417h0544)
  
• Icons and stuff - inmysocks (2016072417h3937)
  

  Now all comments are open by default and you can collapse specific threads if you wish. There is still a lot to do in terms of allowing sorting and the like. I am working on adding avatars for people. I am planning on having them appear next to the author name for posts and maybe other places.

  I have noticed that things slow down when I am typing a new post on my desktop, which means that something is very wrong and we need to fix it because I have a pretty powerful computer. I guess I need to dig into the templates used and see what is going on.

• Comment - Icons and stuff - inmysocks (2016072417h3937)Birthe - I am not able at all to write a post
  

  It is not particularly slower than my rather big recipe wiki to write here - or translating the language plugin to name some examples. (2009 model netbook ;-) BUT if I try to write a new post my wiki automatically refresh itself after a few letters.

• Comment - Comment - Icons and stuff - inmysocks (2016072417h3937)Birthe - I am not able at all to write a post - MAS - Where is author name?
  

  The author of initial blog posts seems to have disappeared. So, for instance, I don't know who was original author of this post ("Icons and stuff"). The wizard doesn't require an author name, and I noticed previously that if two authors were both undefined, the name might show up as either one.

• Comment - Comment - Comment - Icons and stuff - inmysocks (2016072417h3937)Birthe - I am not able at all to write a post - MAS - Where is author name? - inmysocks - It was partly a plugin update
  

  Also if the twCard isn't set up correctly than the author isn't listed. When you post or comment the author name comes from your twcard (since you are on your own wiki). There have been some problems with updating templates so if you have any other problems like that let me or mat know.

• Comment - Comment - Comment - Icons and stuff - inmysocks (2016072417h3937)Birthe - I am not able at all to write a post - MAS - Where is author name? - MAS -
  

  Hmm. Now it's back. Maybe something in the plugin update?

• Comment - Icons and stuff - inmysocks (2016072417h3937)inmysocks - Oh yeah
  

  Since I didn't say it in the post, now there is a new plugin version, so you should update the plugins.

• Issue#4 Change field post_title into caption - Mat von TWaddle (2016072410h5826)
  

  If I recall, Jeremy suggested using the caption field to display as tiddler title... which I guess means replacing the current post_title field.

  Are there any downsides with this? What about tiddlers that pre-twederation use caption fields and that are published

• Idea#1 Tool button to twederate current tiddler - Mat von TWaddle (2016072410h4440)
  

  We should make a toolbar tool button to twederate/publish single tiddlers. I (Mat) imagine I can make this:

  It would create a copy and delete original. In the process it would change/add stuff:

  • title constructed as...
    • current title -
    • look up twCard with wiki_url as current and copy author.
      • If no such info, use current tiddlers creator - what are consequences of this?
    • modified or, if no such, created
  • Other fields
    • author: <same as for author in title>
    • "timestamp fields": deconstruct modified or created
    • post_title: copy original tiddler title
    • role: twDiscussionPost ()
    • sort: is this field needed? What is it?
    • wiki_url: http://tweddle.tiddlyspot.com
  • copy all other fields from original; (not least tags)

• Comment - Idea#1 Tool button to twederate current tiddler - Mat von TWaddle (2016072410h4440)MAS -
  

  I like the idea. Are all these fields needed to turn a tiddler into a post, or just "role" ?

• issue#3 Rephrase doc - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h5223)
  

  $:/plugins/inmysocks/TWederation/Manage twCards

  ...get posts from that wiki, send messages to the wiki...

  should say

  ...get posts from that wiki, address messages to the wiki...

• Issue#1 BlogPostCommentTemplate needs styling - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h1437)
  

  Opening e.g First test in new layout - Mat von TWaddle (2016072323h4836)
  shows $:/plugins/inmysocks/TWederation/Templates/BlogPostCommentTemplate.

  Can this not instead reuse one of the other templates? It seems redundant to repeat so much similar code.

• Issue#2 Need prioritization of posted issues etc - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h1808)
  

  Title says it all. But now how to solve it. maybe we shoudl introduce to enable adding tags to posts?

• Some type of animation or delay going on in the Post Fields? - MAS (2016072319h2246)
  

  There is a noticeable delay when typing in the Post title and content fields (the one I'm typing now). This delay does not occur when typing a regular tiddler, so assume that it is something to do with the new presentation mechanism. I think it must be looping. I have to drop to about 20 WPM to type here. This is true even if I set it to "5" posts. I can type about regular speed in a new tiddler, so it is not just the size of the TW. This is agonizing!!

• Comment - Some type of animation or delay going on in the Post Fields? - MAS (2016072319h2246)MAS -
  

  The delay was most noticeable when using the FF clone "Pale Moon". I sometimes forget that it is not exactly the same as FF. The delay now, as I type (in FF), is noticeable, but tolerable. I notice that as I type, the same letters are being echoed above – not just below the current tiddler. It appears to be entering into the prior comment field (Idea#1 Tool button to twederate current tiddler) It wants to comment as part of two posts at once???

• Comment - Some type of animation or delay going on in the Post Fields? - MAS (2016072319h2246)Birthe - Opening the comments too
  

  Writing a comment is fast enough, but opening comments, that is taking a war to do. I think with the list growing I will have to be seriously curious to open comments to read. Admittedly my computer is neither new or fast.

• Comment - Some type of animation or delay going on in the Post Fields? - MAS (2016072319h2246)inmysocks - I am not sure what is causing that
  

  There shouldn't be anything going on there. It may have to do with a combination of the complexity of the tiddler and the javascript engine. Do you have the same delay if you are writing a comment on another post or it is only in the new post thing at the top?

• twCards with "New card" in title - MAS (2016072319h1539)
  

  There are several cards with "New" in their titles. Since they will only be new once, not sure why/how they are labeled that way.

• Comment - twCards with "New card" in title - MAS (2016072319h1539)inmysocks - That is probably from an old bug
  

  When I fetch new information from google the tiddlers saved used to have the same fields as twCards and this was causing some trouble. So if a twCard has 'New Card' in the title it is supposed to be a temporary tiddler that I used and deleted that I missed. So just delete them and it shouldn't be a problem.

• Draft of 'Will you put photos on meetup page - Birthe (2016071617h2812)'
  

  That would be nice as you have all done a terrific job. Also have a safe journey home all of you!

• [issue#3] Rephrase doc - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h5223)
  

  $:/plugins/inmysocks/TWederation/Manage twCards

  ...get posts from that wiki, send messages to the wiki...

  should say

  ...get posts from that wiki, address messages to the wiki...

• Comment - [issue#3] Rephrase doc - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h5223)inmysocks - Done
  

  This will be in the next version of the plugin.

• [Issue#2] Need prioritization of posted issues etc - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h1808)
  

  Title says it all. But now how to solve it. maybe we shoudl introduce to enable adding tags to posts?

• Comment - [Issue#2] Need prioritization of posted issues etc - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h1808)inmysocks - Yes, we need to do something about this
  

  Tags to posts will probably be enough for a lot of it, but we should also add sorting by author or number of comments or by most recent comments.

• Issue#1 BlogPostCommentTemplate needs styling - or - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h1437)
  

  Opening e.g First test in new layout - Mat von TWaddle (2016072323h4836)
  shows $:/plugins/inmysocks/TWederation/Templates/BlogPostCommentTemplate.

  Can this not instead reuse one of the other templates? It seems redundant to repeat so much similar code.

• FAQ list - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h0305)
  

  I, and anyone who want's to help out, will add comments here to build up a FAQ list. (Hm,"Add comment" is currently not set up for this. Or, rather, I want to create tiddlers as normal and tag them with e.g FAQ and have them appear here... I don't want to have to go here to add stuff to the list! I can imagine a similar need for a "monologue" (as opposed to a discussion) i.e where the user adds a tiddler at a time on some topic.)

• Comment - FAQ list - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h0305)Mat von TWaddle - Publish un-twederated tiddlers, how?
  

  To publish/twederate regular tiddlers

  • ensure the wiki itself is connected to TWederation, i.e has the necessary components
  • Use the publish tool
• Comment - FAQ list - Mat von TWaddle (2016072400h0305)Mat von TWaddle - TWed Core components - which are needed
  

  E.g if I want to twederate an already existing wiki of mine, what do I need to install?

• First test in new layout - Mat von TWaddle (2016072323h4836)
  

  Just a test (this is content)

• Comment - First test in new layout - Mat von TWaddle (2016072323h4836)inmysocks - And this is a reply
  

  Your test post is now part of the twederation and will exist forever! :D

• Comment - Comment - First test in new layout - Mat von TWaddle (2016072323h4836)inmysocks - And this is a reply - Birthe - Well I want to test too
  

  it looks good and yes it is always eciting to test the latest edition.

• Comment - Comment - First test in new layout - Mat von TWaddle (2016072323h4836)inmysocks - And this is a reply - Mat von TWaddle -
  

  Excellent! I will now start to post real stuff.

• How to remake your sites twcard - inmysocks (2016072323h1709)
  

  Delete the tiddler $:/SitetwCard. Then the tiddler TWederation should show the setup wizard instead of the discussions interface. Go through the set-up wizard and when you get to the step asking if you want to be listed say No, then finish the wizard. That should updated your twCard correctly. If it doesn't than I made a mistake somewhere so let me know if anyone tries this and it doesn't work.

• A new look and simplified interface - inmysocks (2016072323h1101)
  

  There are new plugin versions for the twederation-core and twederation-edition plugins! They include some big changes to how a lot of things are made so if you have an existing wiki you may have some problems. After you update the plugins you should modify your twCard so that the type field is empty and add a field called role with the contents twServer. It may be easier to delete all the other twcards you have and pull them from the twederation.tiddlyspot.com again for all your other cards.

  After a lot of work Mat has the basic styling we are using worked out and he created a usable interface for threaded discussions! We decided to remove as much as possible from the UI. This means that we removed the Messages and short messages and moved the new blog post interface to above the posts. We also changed the name from 'Wall' to 'Discussions' since that is the goal of what we are working on for this. The plan is to move away from having the collapsible sub-threads turned on by default. I would have the entire tree visible all the time, but it looks like many people disagree with me. So there will be the option to have collapsible threads and you will be able to set if threads are open or closed by default once we get that worked out.

  All of this configuration is going to be created at some point in the future. We are still working on build the first application of twederation (this threaded discussion stuff) and there are many other things we would like to make, like a library of community created wikitext tricks that you can pull from a wiki to include in your own. So there is a lot of work to do. You shouldn't expect anything like styling to be changed for a bit until we get a good introduction worked out an have everything set up so someone who knows what tiddlywiki is but hasn't every heard of twederation but wants to try it out can actually do something useful without direct guidance.

  For now everything is closed by default. Click on the part below each post that says Open Discussion (x), where the x is the number of comments on that post. Since we have threaded coments now this number isn't the complete number of comments, just the immediate children comments of the post. For now each child will also have the same option to open up further children if they exist. Under each post or comment there is also an Add comment... field, clicking on this opens up the interface for adding a comment. To create a new post click on where it says New Discussion Post at the top of the tiddler and the interface for writing a new post will open up. Click in the same place again will hide the interface. Once you have titled and written your post click on the to save the post or the to close the new post interface. For now closing the interface will not clear the input fields because it is too easy to lose work. I may add some way to clear the fields without saving a new post later.

  A another thing to remember is that you can build many things using twederation, this threaded discussion setup is one application of it, not the entirety of twederation.

  The trees here in Paris are trying to kill me. I don't like allergies, they make me work slowly.

• Trying out IPFS - (11h46-18/7/2016)
  

  Hello from the Interplanetary filesystem!

  I'm editing and saving my Twederation wiki file, and then I'm running ipfs add <filename> and ipfs name publish <returned hash>. I hope this demonstrates that Twederation can be used in conjunction with IPFS, in a limited way.

• Threded discussions and node and changes oh my! - inmysocks (2016071715h4256)
  

  The meetup was a lot of fun and we got a lot of work done. I ended up getting home to Paris a bit late so I missed the last train and had to ride a Velib (the city bike share thing) home. But if you have to ride somewhere at 2am, riding along the Seine at 2am on a Saturday is not a bad choice. I always find the impromptu music/dance parties along the river amusing.

  I don't have the edition set up with all the new plugins yet, but it should be done very soon. Once that is finished I will post something new letting everyone know and hopefully explaining the changes a bit more.

• TWEUM2016 Group Shot.jpg
  
• Will you put photos on meetup page - Birthe (2016071617h2812)
  

  That would be nice as you have all done a terrific job. Also have a safe journey home all of you!

• Hacking Cats - JeremyRuston (2016071612h3641)